Stein: Producers ... they need to focus on reducing the feed conversion rate, so they 
use less feed per pound of gain of the hogs. And they can do that by, first of all, 
focusing on not wasting any feed. So get the feeders adjusted correctly, and make 
sure the pigs don't waste any feed. They can look at formulating the diets correctly 
to have the correct amount of nutrients in the diets, but not overformulated so not 
feed too much of any nutrients. And they also need to look at using the most 
inexpensive feed ingredients that are available, and that is often -- it's often the case 
that we can use ingredients other than corn and soybean meal that are -- that can 
help lower feed costs, and we have a lot of ingredients in Illinois from the wet 
milling industry and from the food industry that can be used.

Gleason: So let's take them up individually. Let's start with not wasting feed. A 
couple of things ... start with the corn grind itself.

Stein: Yeah, we can grind corn to a small particle size, which is down to 400 microns. 
And that will increase the digestibility of the energy in the corn. And that means the 
pig will get more energy out of each pound of corn it eats, and therefore it will eat 
less corn to gain the same amount of weight. So we can save some corn by grinding 
it down to approximately 400 microns, 450 microns. 

Gleason: I'm going to take one little tangent, because there's so much corn from last 
fall that was out of shape, and would have been too high in some toxins. How much 
of a difference does it make in the feed ration for hogs?

Stein: If you have high mycotoxin levels, that can make a difference. It depends on 
which mycotoxins, but if it's aflatoxin, which was the major problem we had last 
year, the diets for pigs -- pigs can tolerate up to approximately 100 parts per billion, 
so they tolerate more than, say, dairy cows. And so we can use a little bit more of 
that. If we have grain that exceeds 100 parts per billion, 120 parts per billion, then 
we need to either have less corn in the ration or we need to blend it together with 
some clean corn so we get the average down in the corn. So that's the only way we 
can handle that.

But if you have 200 parts per billion in the corn and you use 50% corn, then you 
have 100 parts per billion in the diet. So it's in the diet that we need it down to 100 
parts per billion, so that's why I said if you have high aflatoxin in the corn, you need 
to use less of that corn in the diet.

Gleason: OK, we'll get to the alternative feed ingredients in a moment. Let's go back 
to thing that a producer can do. We talked about the grind. The feeders are 
important, you suggest, and having them set properly.

Stein: Adjusting feeders is a very important thing. If they are not adjusted correctly, 
if there's too much feed in the feeders, then the pigs will waste that, and they'll root 
it out of the feeder, and it will get into the slats and disappear in the pit. And 
obviously, that cannot be utilized. And we have seen research where they've shown 
between 5 and 10% of all the feed that comes into the feeder ends up under the 
slats, so it's not eaten. So adjusting those feeders correctly is very important in 
terms of feed conversion rates.

Gleason: Now let's talk about the alternatives. In the state of Illinois, let's work with 
ADM, Tate & Lyle in Decatur, Illinois. There's corn gluten and some other products 
that are available.

Stein: There are a number of products coming out of the wet milling industry: corn 
gluten meal, corn gluten feed, corn germ meal -- which is the defatted corn germ, it's 
a very good ingredient -- and there are some newer products also, corn extractives 
and some other things that they mix together. So there are a number of products 
there that can be used in diets for pigs, but maybe 20%, maybe 25%, in that area. 
And right now, that is a very good buy, so it will lower feed costs if we include some 
of those ingredients.

You need to make sure the diets are formulated correctly. So we have the correct 
amount of nutrients in the diets. And that's why producers need to work with a 
nutritionist or their feed company to make sure that they get the diets correctly 
formulated. They cannot just take out corn and put in corn germ meal, or DDGS or 
something else. They need to have a balance. But if they do that, then the pigs will do 
very well on many of these coproducts.

Gleason: DDGS. Is it simply a substitute for corn, or a substitute for corn and for 
bean meal?

Stein: DDGS is a substitute for both corn and bean meal, and on average, if you have 
100 pounds of DDGS in the diet, you take out about 55 pounds of corn and 45 
pounds of bean meal. So you substitute both of them. And then you add a little bit of 
synthetic lysine to balance the lysine. That's how we do that.

Gleason: Is it a good alternative as well?

Stein: DDGS is a very good alternative. We use 20%, 25, sometimes up to 35%, in the 
diets, so that would be 400 or up to 700 pounds per ton, and that works very well. 
We have seen very good results with that, and we just need to make sure the diets 
are balanced on amino acids and phosphorus also.

Gleason: Some of the ethanol plants have found that DDGS as a coproduct works 
very well, but have also found a market for corn oil, or oil coming out of that DDGS 
or the corn that is being ground for ethanol, and that changes some of the rations, 
and the way it's used in hog feed.

Stein: Yeah. There is the technology now where the ethanol plants -- they will skim 
off the fat from the solubles and that results in DDGS being produced that contain 
only between 6 and 9% fat, and not the 10-11% we have seen in the past for 
conventional DDGS. However that fat they take off is relatively poorly digested by 
the pigs, so it doesn't hurt the energy in the pigs -- in the DDGS as much as you 
would expect. And we have -- our research indicates that you would not be able to 
see a difference between whether it's a 6% fat or a 9% fat DDGS. And our research 
has shown that, and other places have shown the same thing. So we are relatively 
comfortable getting down to 6% fat. If you get down to 2 or 3% fat, there is a 
difference. But 6, 7, 8%, we are OK.

Gleason: So there are other small grains that are grown in the state. How can we use 
them, and which small grains are useful?

Stein: Well, we have -- the most important one is wheat. We do have wheat grown in 
the southern part of the state particularly, and also in Missouri. And it is combined 
early, so that means if you run out of corn in July or August, there may be 
opportunities to buy wheat -- feed-grade wheat -- and that's a very good deal. You 
can pretty much substitute corn for wheat, and you actually can take out a little bit 
of bean meal at the same time because there's more amino acids in wheat compared 
with corn. So it does help in the formulation, and so if you can buy wheat at the same 
price or less than corn, it's a very -- it's going to improve profitability.

Barley is another good source of energy we can use in the diets. However, we don't 
grow a lot of barley in Illinois so it'll have to be trucked in, and so it depends on 
what the cost will be. Same thing for field peas and oats and stuff like that; if they 
are available at a competitive cost, we can definitely use it, very good ingredients to 
use. And we do have quite a bit of information on our website about those 
ingredients also.